Cross Effects: Rebirth (2.0) Discussion Page (OOC).

[Brahmastra]

Course it didn't stop me. Im taking creative freedom about a character we know next-to-nothing about, whereas he-who-is-no-longer-with-us-and-shall-not-be-named raped canon in it's bunghole.

[Cherry Lover]

Course it didn't stop me. Im taking creative freedom about a character we know next-to-nothing about, whereas he-who-is-no-longer-with-us-and-shall-not-be-named raped canon in it's bunghole.

No, you are ridiculously overpowering your character beyond any reasonable level. Which is just as much "raping canon" as anything Lantz ever did. She is not a better magus than Medea, to claim she is is absolutely fucking ridiculous.

[Knick]

I agree that her stats are bit to high, but even still he is not flat out tossing aside what we know about canon. He is taking many creative liberties like I did when I made my #4 of the burial agency. Even if he was an Expy.

But ya, stats do feel just a bit to high. Would prefer if you have spells that  boost them to those level for a moment rather then it just being constant reinforcement. Would feel more like a supermage that way.

[Cherry Lover]

I agree that her stats are bit to high, but even still he is not flat out tossing aside what we know about canon. He is taking many creative liberties like I did when I made my #4 of the burial agency. Even if he was an Expy.

I think he is tossing out canon in some cases, especially with regard to her magic ability. It is stated time and time again that magic has got weaker in the modern era. So, how is a modern magus at the top level of magical power (which is what A+ implies)?

But ya, stats do feel just a bit to high. Would prefer if you have spells that  boost them to those level for a moment rather then it just being constant reinforcement. Would feel more like a supermage that way.

Well, the stats are too high but perhaps just about doable. Her magic ability is fucking ridiculous, though. He's saying she is one of the strongest magicians who ever lived, including all the famous historical ones.

[Mooncake]

No, you are ridiculously overpowering your character beyond any reasonable level. Which is just as much "raping canon" as anything Lantz ever did. She is not a better magus than Medea, to claim she is is absolutely fucking ridiculous.

BZZZZZZZZZT

WRONG


Lorelei is explicitly stated to:

A) Use only the most basic spells, and
B) Is only a couple steps away from achieving True Magic with them


We're talking someone who hunts Dead Apostle Ancestors on a red moon for fun.

In classic RP terms, she's someone who with her base spell (let's use "Magic Missile" as an example), is capable of doing 999999999 damage. In other words she's that person who pours all of her points into stats and can do everything better than everyone even with the most basic skills. So, yes, her magic capability is on par with or exceeds Medea's. Do agree parts of the sheet are a little over the top, though.

[Brahmastra]

I agree that her stats are bit to high, but even still he is not flat out tossing aside what we know about canon. He is taking many creative liberties like I did when I made my #4 of the burial agency. Even if he was an Expy.

I think he is tossing out canon in some cases, especially with regard to her magic ability. It is stated time and time again that magic has got weaker in the modern era. So, how is a modern magus at the top level of magical power (which is what A+ implies)?

Barthomeloi is an Age-of-Gods-old Magus family.

[Daiki]

Yeah, the Barthomeloi have special Magic Circuits.

The hunting on red moon isn't for fun. She's just the only one who dares to take the unnecessary risks.

"Strongest known living human" is still several levels below "heroic spirit".

Aoko can fight with average Servants. Ciel can to an extent. So not necessarily severals level below. Barty is a way better magus than both. She could match Servants in the right conditions. Forget engaging physically with Berserker or going for sword fight with Saber, but the possibility is there.

Lorelei hunts Dead Apostle Ancestors (who are easily High-Servant tier) on red moons (where they are at their strongest) for sport

Simply put, she's the Bruce Lee of modern Magi.

She does but she mostly fights alone. As in 'take care of the nest while I'm going for the boss' kind of cooperation.

Also, I'm not convinced DAAs are "high-servant tier".

It's more of a matter of affinity and concept than raw power. However, the top ten are at least a match for the high end Servants and iirc, they are specified to be non-killable at this point by the Church. So it's a matter of who has the means to kill the other. For example, I don't think there are many HS who can deal with Nrvnqsr while he could swallow most of them.

[Cherry Lover]

In classic RP terms, she's someone who with her base spell (let's use "Magic Missile" as an example), is capable of doing 999999999 damage. In other words she's that person who pours all of her points into stats and can do everything better than everyone even with the most basic skills. So, yes, her magic capability is on par with or exceeds Medea's. Do agree parts of the sheet are a little over the top, though.

Well, it's not even just Medea. A+ servant magic means "just about the best magician who has existed in all of history". I find that extremely hard to believe.

[Brahmastra]

Then don't, I'm not stopping you, I'm just saying that you're wrong, but you can still not believe it.

[Daiki]

In particular, her magic stat is absurd. There is no way in hell she is better at magic than Medea, which is what you are implying.

The output or potential might be superior, it doesn't mean she equals or can best Medea in a match. AoG magecraft is ridiculously OP. Even Aoko with the Fifth can't beat her.

[Cherry Lover]

In particular, her magic stat is absurd. There is no way in hell she is better at magic than Medea, which is what you are implying.

The output or potential might be superior, it doesn't mean she equals or can best Medea in a match. AoG magecraft is ridiculously OP. Even Aoko with the Fifth can't beat her.

Yes, which is my point. If he says she as A+ magic ability on the servant scale, that means she is as good as the best AoG magicians (who would also come out as A+ magic ability). Which just seems absurd to me.

The "Magic Ability" stat isn't a measure of prana (which I don't think she has an exceptional amount of anyway), it's a measure of how good she is at magic. I can't see how she can be as good as the best AoG magicians.

[Brahmastra]

What Daiki said. Lorelei probably could never beat Medea in a straight Magecraft fight, but Medea has the physical abilities of a wet paper bag and would get slapped the shit out of her with some holy mithril while Lorelei fended off her attacks.

[Cherry Lover]

What Daiki said. Lorelei probably could never beat Medea in a straight Magecraft fight, but Medea has the physical abilities of a wet paper bag and would get slapped the shit out of her with some holy mithril while Lorelei fended off her attacks.

Sure (even Rin managed that, after all), but I'm talking about the "Magic Ability" stat specifically. Your stats imply that Lorelei could beat Medea in a battle of pure magic.

[Daiki]

Yes, which is my point. If he says she as A+ magic ability on the servant scale, that means she is as good as the best AoG magicians (who would also come out as A+ magic ability). Which just seems absurd to me.

Magic Ability should regroup more than that imo but w/e, that's not even relevant here.

The "Magic Ability" stat isn't a measure of prana (which I don't think she has an exceptional amount of anyway)

She's described as having more circuits than the 2000+ years old director of the MA(An AoG magus). Add to that A+++ circuits quality and you get a pretty powerful magus. Extremely old house of magi which put to shame those like the Edelfelt (also AoG lineage which inherited a weapon from a god).

it's a measure of how good she is at magic. I can't see how she can be as good as the best AoG magicians.

But she's in the same range as Medea. Only she can't hope to win against an AoG magus because compatibility is terrible.

To give you an idea, let's go with the Gandr shot Rin uses in FSN which is a basic curse. Let's imagine an average magus like Waver using it. Let's assume Lorelei also knows it. The three of them use it. Waver can somewhat manage to reproduce the effect and cripple his opponent. Rin, being very skilled overall and having it in her Crest can push to the level of physical interference and shoot through a wall. Lorelei can blow up half the school with hers. Yes, that's ridiculous but that's how good she is.

[YOLF]

Also just because she has A+ magic ability doesn't mean she's better than Medea as a magus. That's her ability at modern magecraft.

Medea doesn't even have Circuits, and mostly uses High Speed Divine Words. They use fundamentally different kinds of magic, so even if Lorelei has A+ magic ability in the "Servant Scale" it doesn't make her more powerful than Medea.