Cross Effects - Sign Up, Discussion Page

[Arch-Magos Winter]

As for the OP regard. BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. No. I'm about as IC as possible. Characters run into conflict. It's what makes a good fucking story. Raul is completely acting IC here, because he doesn't know about Satoshi coming from another universe. He doesn't know the Castle isn't Infrastructure, because he has no frame of reference for a structure rising from nowhere in a fucking couple of hours outside of infrastructure.

Then what sort of consequences actually happen if Satoshi can do whatever the fuck he wants? He can't go to jail because you and Lantz won't allow it, he can't be injured because neither you nor Lantz will allow it. He can't die because 'THAT WOULDN'T BE LITERARY BAWWWW' or some shit. So instead, he god modes all the fucking time and gets on everyone's nerves but apparently yours for some reason.

And the same thing applies to my characters too, something you seem to be ignoring - they can die too. It isn't just your characters who would be able to die, it's everyones. Otherwise, it isn't fair. Get the drop on them, be more powerful than them, exploit a weakness, they die. And death? Death isn't fucking fair. Characterization issues shouldn't ruin the RP for you if you believe, as you've claimed, that this is about character development. You fucking roll with it. You have your characters react to it, act about it, mourn the loss, swear revenge, whatever. That's literary. That's writing a story. That's how a story works. Characters come into conflict, sometimes violent, sometimes not, but they clash, and learn.

So basically, all you want to do is wank off to Rider. While I can't condemn you for that, I can condemn you for doing so on our time.

[Cherry Lover]

No, my characters would not develop if one of them died, they would break. Certainly over the timeframe of the RP, anyway. People don't magically recover from their friend/husband/children dying.

And, frankly, the stuff about consequences just proves my and Lantz's point. You want to punish Lantz because he RPs in a way you don't like, and you're taking your OOC anger out on him ICly. And using the fact that the RP is free-form to try to do it. That is not on at all, and Lantz is totally correct to tell you where to stick it.

If you want Lantz to be punished for "god-moding" then go complain to Elf. But, since she hasn't done so yet I suspect you will find that you are out of luck.

As for the rest, you are again missing the point. It is not even because I am giving up something I care about and you are not. I mind my characters dying and you don't, so to say "but everyone's character can die so it is fair" is just plain bullshit.

Or, at least, it is no more true than saying "well, you can prevent your characters dying if you choose, so it's fair", which is just as convincing an argument in favour of my approach. They are different ways of playing, yes, but they are both entirely valid ways of playing. You do not get to dictate which one we pick.

Elf made the nature of the RP damn clear, if you don't like it then fuck off. Stop moaning because people don't want to play your way.

[Arch-Magos Winter]

If you're implying that anyone will kill Kiyoshi you're making me laugh. He's 11. 11. Are you fucking kidding me?

And the point about consequences is brought up because Lantz is playing the character like nothing can or will effect him. It's making me sick, and it's even worse how he was blatantly dictating and metagaming about the castle. He blatantly stated earlier in the Sign Up thread that Inferno Cop couldn't arrest him, and said he'd lie to him and Inferno Cop would believe it - that's not cool on any level. He's expecting everyone to conform to his view of the RP, and pulls shit out of his ass to attempt for that to happen - Angra in the garage, and there's the shit with the fight with forest earlier... etc etc. etc. I could rant about this here but I won't because Elf would disapprove.

And my point is this: Why should you care about them. Why. This is for fun. If they die, they die. You can always make a new character. It isn't hard. Let them die.

[The Man With All The Cute Boats]

Because Satoshi and Rider won't let him?

waitwaitwaitwaitwaitwaitwait...

A cop does their in-character cop thing and tries to make a guy pay for his crimes, the person fights back along with a naked woman far up their ass castle, the cop fights back this resisting of arrest to bring the guy in, and somehow the "fight back" part is condemned because "le joke character lel" ain't allowed?

A joke character is partly a joke, yeah, but as long as they don't pull some random power from episode whatever where they time travel or conquer the pyramids, he should be taken as seriously as any other. Just, written with more sillyness than most, and with sillier gizmos.

Inferno Cop can fight back just fine without pulling out some stupid broken shit, and he'll still be a joke character. Just look at how Axe Cop was acting in the apartment building when Connor tried to whack Law. Joke character in a serious scene acted to stop someone, the scene worked.

[Cherry Lover]

If you're implying that anyone will kill Kiyoshi you're making me laugh. He's 11. 11. Are you fucking kidding me?

And the point about consequences is brought up because Lantz is playing the character like nothing can or will effect him. It's making me sick, and it's even worse how he was blatantly dictating and metagaming about the castle. He blatantly stated earlier in the Sign Up thread that Inferno Cop couldn't arrest him, and said he'd lie to him and Inferno Cop would believe it - that's not cool on any level. He's expecting everyone to conform to his view of the RP, and pulls shit out of his ass to attempt for that to happen - Angra in the garage, and there's the shit with the fight with forest earlier... etc etc. etc. I could rant about this here but I won't because Elf would disapprove.

And my point is this: Why should you care about them. Why. This is for fun. If they die, they die. You can always make a new character. It isn't hard. Let them die.

Not just Kiyoshi, also Rider, Sakura, Aoi and Shirou. They're a family, if you kill one of them it will break the others.

As for Lantz, if you're accusing him of dictating then I think that you're being damn hypocritical given how you're acting right now. And, he can't force Inferno Cop to believe him, whatever he says. However, you really should have consideration for other people's interests in the RP too. If you had that, people might be more willing to have consideration for yours.

And, I care about the characters because I do, and I want to continue playing those characters. I am not absolutely ruling out character death but I will make the decision, not you. That is how I want the RP to be played, and I have just as much right to play my way as you do to play your way.

If Elf wanted characters to die freely and people to allow that then she would not have added the rule saying character deaths required the player's consent. The fact that that rule is there means it is entirely within the spirit of the RP for me to say I do not wish for it to happen. That is the culture of the RP and I like that culture. You do not get to unilaterally change it just because you don't.

Frankly, Magos, you are expecting us to bend to your wishes and RP in a way that is enjoyable for you without taking any notice of what is enjoyable for us, and I see absolutely no reason why I or anyone else should go along with it. Come back to the argument when you actually have something to offer beyond "waahh, you're allowed to do what you want and I'm not, I want it to be the other way around".

Because Satoshi and Rider won't let him?

waitwaitwaitwaitwaitwaitwait...

A cop does their in-character cop thing and tries to make a guy pay for his crimes, the person fights back along with a naked woman far up their ass castle, the cop fights back this resisting of arrest to bring the guy in, and somehow the "fight back" part is condemned because "le joke character lel" ain't allowed?

A joke character is partly a joke, yeah, but as long as they don't pull some random power from episode whatever where they time travel or conquer the pyramids, he should be taken as seriously as any other. Just, written with more sillyness than most, and with sillier gizmos.

Inferno Cop can fight back just fine without pulling out some stupid broken shit, and he'll still be a joke character. Just look at how Axe Cop was acting in the apartment building when Connor tried to whack Law. Joke character in a serious scene acted to stop someone, the scene worked.

Well, I only mind if he starts using OP abilities that wouldn't be allowed in a normal character to do it. But, if he doesn't I find it hard to see him arresting Rider and Satoshi. They're both towards the top-end of Nasuverse characters, and he'd be facing two of them, and in Satoshi's castle where he has all sorts of crap to fight off intruders. Plus, Rider is basically impossible to arrest, because she is a magical being that can become incorporeal, and if you cut off her magic then she will die.

[Arch-Magos Winter]

Well, I only mind if he starts using OP abilities to do it. But, if he doesn't I find it hard to see him arresting Rider and Satoshi.

This is totally hypocrisy Mike. Especially considering your above post.

And there's a difference between dictating actions and saying 'Hey, you should let your characters you know, die. It isn't harming you.' One's a fucking dick move to everyone, and the other is a suggestion.

I also want to point out that aside from you and Lantz, NOBODY HERE MINDS CHARACTER DEATH. You can do tyranny of the Majority all you want but in this case I'm all for the Tyrants.

[Cherry Lover]

Actually, I think you're wrong about character death. I think most people will be willing to accept it in some circumstances, but not arbitrarily. I'm pretty sure Elf would not generally accept Forest getting killed, for example, because she wants to RP as her. You're right that asking is fine, but I've answered why I consider it to be harmful to me several times and you still keep insisting, so you're not asking you're dictating.

And, this is not a majority rule situation. The GM writes the rules for the RP, you don't get to change them by majority vote. If you want an RP run by your rules you can make one.

As for Inferno Cop, my point is that he was accepted as a joke character and his powers were allowed in only because of that. If he arrests Satoshi and Rider he isn't really acting as a joke character at that point in time, so he shouldn't be allowed to use OP abilities to do so, particularly since him doing so makes things awkward for us.

[Arch-Magos Winter]

Actually, I think you're wrong about character death. I think most people will be willing to accept it in some circumstances, but not arbitrarily. I'm pretty sure Elf would not generally accept Forest getting killed, for example, because she wants to RP as her. You're right that asking is fine, but I've answered why I consider it to be harmful to me several times and you still keep insisting, so you're not asking you're dictating.

And, this is not a majority rule situation. The GM writes the rules for the RP, you don't get to change them by majority vote. If you want an RP run by your rules you can make one.

As for Inferno Cop, my point is that he was accepted as a joke character and his powers were allowed in only because of that. If he arrests Satoshi and Rider he isn't really acting as a joke character at that point in time, so he shouldn't be allowed to use OP abilities to do so, particularly since him doing so makes things awkward for us.

Accepted and I know this. I'm just hoping Elf agrees.

And as for Inferno Cop, the hypocrisy from you continues. You're basically saying "NO HE CAN'T USE HIS POWERS WHEN IT WOULD INCONVIENENCE US EVER!" which is blatantly godmoding. You don't make the rules Mike. Neither do I.

[Bloble]

Inferno Cop can do his thing without busting out the bullshit OP abilities, Mike. The fact that you believe him making things awkward for your characters is a bad thing is actually offensive for me. This is a roleplay, not a world where everything goes right and everyone's nice and happy and you can have all the badly written sex you want. Tense situations bring about character growth. Loss brings character growth. Having to deal with shit you don't want to deal with brings character growth. I'm not telling you to kill off your characters, but if you don't want to deal with something inconvenient IC, then that's your problem, not ours.

EDIT: Don't know why I mentioned that person, must've been a typo or something or maybe me secretly fantasizing.

[Cherry Lover]

Accepted and I know this. I'm just hoping Elf agrees.

Given that she wrote the rules originally with none of us telling her what to put in there I would be surprised, particularly given that she has several strong objections to changing it. It would very much change the nature of the RP and I don't think that's what she wants.

And as for Inferno Cop, the hypocrisy from you continues. You're basically saying "NO HE CAN'T USE HIS POWERS WHEN IT WOULD INCONVIENENCE US EVER!" which is blatantly godmoding. You don't make the rules Mike. Neither do I.

I'm saying that it is deeply unfair to have a character that was introduced as an OP joke character act seriously but still be allowed to be OP. And, arresting them is serious because it has significant consequences for them.

But, yes, you're right that it's not our decision, it's Elf's decision. And Names' decision as to whether he does it in the first place. I said he shouldn't be allowed not that he isn't allowed....

Inferno Cop can do his thing without busting out the bullshit OP abilities, Mike. The fact that you believe him making things awkward for your characters is a bad thing is actually offensive for me. This is a roleplay, not a world where everything goes right and everyone's nice and happy and you can have all the badly written sex you want. Tense situations bring about character growth. Loss brings character growth. Having to deal with shit you don't want to deal with brings character growth. I'm not telling you to kill off your characters, but if you don't want to deal with something inconvenient IC, then that's your problem, not ours.

Getting arrested and thrown in a cell makes RPing difficult.

Tension and tense situations are fine, but as someone who is deeply Chaotic in nature I find it rather worrying to have a cop running around who can arrest two of the most powerful characters in the RP in the house of one of them. It makes following the law almost required, and I don't think that's a good thing (particularly since if he can arrest them he can arrest the actual bad guys).

[Arch-Magos Winter]

Inferno Cop can do his thing without busting out the bullshit OP abilities, Mike. The fact that you believe him making things awkward for your characters is a bad thing is actually offensive for me. This is a roleplay, not a world where everything goes right and everyone's nice and happy and you can have all the badly written sex you want. Tense situations bring about character growth. Loss brings character growth. Having to deal with shit you don't want to deal with brings character growth. I'm not telling you to kill off your characters, but if you don't want to deal with something inconvenient IC, then that's your problem, not ours.

EDIT: Don't know why I mentioned that person, must've been a typo or something or maybe me secretly fantasizing.

This. What you want to do mike is basically write fanfiction. Then write the fucking fanfiction. You don't always get to come out on top.

Getting arrested and thrown in a cell makes RPing difficult.

Not really. I'm not having any problems.

[Cherry Lover]

No, but nor should you guys always get to come out on top. Inferno Cop is at a significant disadvantage at the moment, he's in Satoshi's house and Satoshi has backup (potentially Alter as well as Rider). So, if he can manage to arrest them by force now he's going to be able to arrest just about anyone.

Also, Rider can't really be imprisoned anyway, not without pulling some serious shit out of your ass. And I would expect Satoshi to be difficult to transfer, especially with Rider trying to free him.

[Bloble]

All I can say to your protest is: Too bad.

This isn't THE LAW. This is a character acting like himself. You don't like it? Too. Bad. None of the RP's rules are being broken. Breaking the law is your choice, and being imprisoned is the consequence. If you don't like it, deal with it. You can't ask for us to disregard or get rid of things you don't like, especially since the Nexus isn't some lawless zone where you can do whatever the hell you want.

And you're assuming that your position guarantees your safety. That's wrong. It's entirely possible for Inferno Cop to do his thing despite his disadvantages. I'm sure even in any other situation you'd be protesting.

And we haven't always come out on top. Lawrence got away from the entire team just by breaking down our car. It took Axe Cop all day to drag Lawrence to jail, and the crazy arrancar chick ran off without him being able to do anything about it. We're not the OP ones here, Mike. You and lantz are, although not to the extent that Magos seems to think.

[Cherry Lover]

My point is that if Inferno Cop can arrest them in this situation then he is OP, and that is very definitely not a good thing for the RP. This is not real life, all of our characters are going to necessarily end up breaking the law in order to RP. It should not be impossible for them to do so.

And, how the hell can we be OP when you're stating that Inferno Cop can beat both of us on Satoshi's home ground?

[Arch-Magos Winter]

My point is that if Inferno Cop can arrest them in this situation then he is OP, and that is very definitely not a good thing for the RP. This is not real life, all of our characters are going to necessarily end up breaking the law in order to RP. It should not be impossible for them to do so.

And, how the hell can we be OP when you're stating that Inferno Cop can beat both of us on Satoshi's home ground?

I think you're forgetting that Raul will be raising merry hell because this situation is his bread and butter. Demons love chaos like this. Infrastructure falls, happy Demons dance on the ashes.