Cross Effects - Sign Up, Discussion Page

[Cherry Lover]

Lantz, if people have criticism of your character or their actions they have a right to state it. They have a valid point here, which is that projecting a car is quite extreme, and most people would probably say that a normal magus, even a rather powerful one, couldn't do it (Rin, for example, would be hard-pressed to). Plus, twenty minutes is quite a long time for a projection to last.

At the same time, though, I can see your point here. Canon isn't overly-clear on how projection works, or on whether something like this would be doable. And, since not being able to do it would leave us stuck, I am inclined to say it should be OK.

[lantzblades]

It never stops with Alice ever. I can't RP the way I want I can't produce fan fiction the way I want, can't contribute at fucking all.

frankly Rin says IN CANON that a projection fades when it stops being supported, I never said she stopped supporting it. As with the first bit in the alley you've assumed my characters actions. Stop it.

[Alice]

In this case, lantz? You have no right to tell me what I can and cannot do. And I didn't assume, lantz, you just ignored what everyone else was doing. If anyone should stop hurling accusations, it's you. 

[Bloble]

I dunno lantz, projecting a car is... pretty far out there. I'd buy a skateboard or maybe a bike at a stretch, but something with that many separate moving parts doesn't seem possible, not to mention the chemical reactions that need to happen in the engine for it to work. Projections are supposed to be stuff like hollow duplicates of simple objects, not something this big or complicated. Plus to understand a car, Sakura would have first had to take it apart and examine every individual piece, and that's no joke.

[lantzblades]

The van is Shirou's that she helped to build bloble so I already covered that and to repeat. In canon Rin states that as long as a magi continues fueling a projection it will continue to exist. That is why Shirou has special projections in comparison because his stay without outside influence. It's canon the only reason people don't commonly do it is because it's a waste to create a temporary object that big. Just because it's not a good idea does not mean impossible  and again Rin in canon tells how normal projection works. It can be done according to canon.

[Alice]

Like Bloble says though (you people keep saying stuff so much better than I do ), there's too many moving parts and too many small chemical reactions occurring to make it logically possible. Even if she has worked with the car, I doubt she's literally taken every piece apart and knows every single chemical reaction that occurs.

And it's big, mundane object or not. Assuming she has the same level of prana as Rin, it should at best knock her out and at worst kill her. If she lived, it could fry her circuits. She can hardly maintain it for a long period of time when her prana's pretty much gone to begin with. Again, it's implausible.

[Cherry Lover]

You shouldn't need to understand the chemical reactions to project the car, though. You just need to project the fluids in question.

The fact is that we just don't know. Nasu has never addressed the question, or any similar one. I suspect that you probably couldn't project a car with Rin-level prana, but I am not willing to say for certain that you could not.

[lantzblades]

The consequences are mine to show. Canon says it's possible. The effect on Sakura is my business. There is a point to why I'm doing this. And again I said built, she built the van.

[Arch-Magos Winter]

You shouldn't need to understand the chemical reactions to project the car, though. You just need to project the fluids in question.

The fact is that we just don't know. Nasu has never addressed the question, or any similar one. I suspect that you probably couldn't project a car with Rin-level prana, but I am not willing to say for certain that you could not.

True, but you still need to understand how that powers the engine, and you need to get the chemical structure of those fluids exactly right otherwise you could unintentionally end up with a totally different fluid.

For that matter, this whole scenario is basically the problem with Lantz's OC's in a nutshell - they have no weaknesses and seem to be better at everything they do than their parents. I mean, for fucks sake Satoshi basically can never be killed, has absurd magical ability, is a fucking dragon, is really 2000 years old, has an 'oh my god so special and cool' sword, a second 'oh my god so special and cool' sword, and somehow for that matter killed Gilgamesh and defeated Arc (After which considering what lantz has written about him, he boned her) and then the icing on the cake - a reality marble. Oh, and he pisses off counter guardians for fun.

Seriously, we need to pull an intervention here.

The consequences are mine to show. Canon says it's possible. The effect on Sakura is my business. There is a point to why I'm doing this. And again I said built, she built the van.

Even if she did build the van, here's the kicker  - SHE DIDN'T BUILD THE GAS, THE BATTERY, THE OIL, OR THE FUCKING WIPER FLUID! Lantz, I don't think you GET just how many individual moving parts are in an engine, that have to be millimeter precise or they simply won't work. And I can TELL this explanation is being pulled out of your ass here. In this case, when everyone else is calling bullshit (Except Mike, but mike isn't supporting you on this one and taking a neutral stance), you need to take a step back, and wait for a GM ruling. For that matter, even if she DID for the sake of argument project every individual piece, that would likely cost MORE mana and boil her brain from the sheer information overload required.

[lantzblades]

You are spreading misinformation arch. Stop it. And no I am not ass pulling.

[Cherry Lover]

True, but you still need to understand how that powers the engine, and you need to get the chemical structure of those fluids exactly right otherwise you could unintentionally end up with a totally different fluid.

That would apply to projecting absolutely anything though, however simple it might be. I'm pretty sure magi don't project things on a molecular level....

And, no, I don't see why you would need to understand how the fuel powers the engine to make it work. You just need to know how the engine is designed. Do you think your average engine manufacturing worker knows the chemical reactions that occur to run the engine they built?

For that matter, this whole scenario is basically the problem with Lantz's OC's in a nutshell - they have no weaknesses and seem to be better at everything they do than their parents.

They do have weaknesses....

I mean, for fucks sake Satoshi basically can never be killed, has absurd magical ability, is a fucking dragon, is really 2000 years old, has an 'oh my god so special and cool' sword, a second 'oh my god so special and cool' sword, and somehow for that matter killed Gilgamesh and defeated Arc (After which considering what lantz has written about him, he boned her) and then the icing on the cake - a reality marble. Oh, and he pisses off counter guardians for fun.

Can you please stop just spouting stuff about Satoshi that is taken out of context or just wrong? I don't think Toshi ever defeated Arc, and he certainly didn't fuck her, not canonically. The rest is just out of context I think, and designed to make him look bad.

Even if she did build the van, here's the kicker  - SHE DIDN'T BUILD THE GAS, THE BATTERY, THE OIL, OR THE FUCKING WIPER FLUID! Lantz, I don't think you GET just how many individual moving parts are in an engine, that have to be millimeter precise or they simply won't work. And I can TELL this explanation is being pulled out of your ass here. In this case, when everyone else is calling bullshit (Except Mike, but mike isn't supporting you on this one and taking a neutral stance), you need to take a step back, and wait for a GM ruling. For that matter, even if she DID for the sake of argument project every individual piece, that would likely cost MORE mana and boil her brain from the sheer information overload required.

I doubt she needs to worry about wiper fluid, and I would imagine that oil, gas and battery fluid is relatively simple to understand. The engine though, yeah, that is quite complex.

[Alice]

Magos is just saying what he knows about Toshi, although there's a couple of things that are incorrect, yes (the sex with Arc thing, since I think that just happens in the gajillion side pairing things lantz writes and then abandons before even working on them, and the... defeating her thing I think, though that one I'm not sure on). The rest though? He's going off of what he knows. lantz won't go into any further detail is the problem.

Same with their weaknesses. It's not obvious to us what those are. He needs to say what those weaknesses are, though that should come out in the writing as well, which is a problem, but again, Magos is working off of what he knows here. All he has is the character sheet, that's what he's using to try to understand Toshi, and in this case, it's relevant because it's what's being used for the RP.

[Arch-Magos Winter]

You are spreading misinformation arch. Stop it. And no I am not ass pulling.

It isn't spreading misinformation when all that is taken from his FUCKING CHARACTER SHEET AND YOUR STATEMENTS LANTZ. MISINFORMATION WOULD BE SAYING HE'S RIDING A UNICORN RAINBOW AND IS AS GAY AS A SUNFLOWER OR SOMETHING, WHICH HE ISN'T!


And that's another thing, his weaknesses don't come across inside the text. Neither do Sakura's or Connors or Taiga's. They all just... are perfect. I mean, EX charisma? Are you shitting me? Doesn't that sorta mean everyone should love her? What's the catch for a fucking normalish human to have that sort of charisma? Is she just that damn perfect? Because if so she doesn't act like it.

Satoshi for that matter doesn't act like some 2000 year old wise man, he acts like a holy self righteous cunt.

[lantzblades]

It is misinformation arch, stop it.

as for you Alice your conjecture about my writing habits which you know nothing about is unwelcome. Please stop.

[Cherry Lover]

You are spreading misinformation arch. Stop it. And no I am not ass pulling.

It isn't spreading misinformation when all that is taken from his FUCKING CHARACTER SHEET AND YOUR STATEMENTS LANTZ. MISINFORMATION WOULD BE SAYING HE'S RIDING A UNICORN RAINBOW AND IS AS GAY AS A SUNFLOWER OR SOMETHING, WHICH HE ISN'T!

Where did Lantz say he defeated Arc? And, like I said, the "fucking her" bit is not canon in any way.

Also, please calm down, Arch....